Feedback Matters: Tandem's Co-Founders Discuss Remote Feedback Strategies - ep. 076

Explore the dynamic landscape of remote work with Melissa Miller, Co-Founder and COO, and Lauren Humphrey, Co-Founder and CEO at Tandem, in this episode that was recorded live at the Transform HR conference in Last Vegas. Join host Kaleem Clarkson and our guests as they share valuable insights around feedback in a remote work setting. From Melissa's unexpected forklift license in Alaska to Lauren's humorous fear of mascots, enjoy these lighthearted introductions that set the tone for an insightful discussion.

Diving deep into the evolution of remote work, Melissa and Lauren draw from their backgrounds at Gusto and their previous venture, Mintable, to highlight the significance of intentional feedback in remote environments. As pioneers in the field, their collective experiences have inspired them to co-found Tandem, a groundbreaking platform dedicated to facilitating continuous feedback within organizations.

Reflecting on their recent workshop at Transform HR, Melissa and Lauren explored the challenges and advantages of giving feedback remotely. They emphasize the crucial role of intentionality and effective communication in nurturing a culture of constructive feedback, particularly in today's remote and hybrid work settings.

Get actionable insights into navigating the intricacies of remote work and feedback management! From building trust to setting clear expectations, Melissa and Lauren underscore the importance of leveraging innovative tools like Tandem to drive engagement and enhance performance in distributed teams.

Thank you for the enlightening conversation, Melissa and Lauren.

This episode was sponsored by Tandem.

Learn more about employee feedback at https://tandem.team/

Learn more about Melissa and Lauren:

• Melissa’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mmiller6/
• Lauren’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/laurenfhumphrey/
• Tandem: https://tandem.team/

Transcript

Kaleem: 0:35

All right. Here we are. We are in the tandem booth. Chilling with some tandem folks. I am so excited. We are at transform. It's been live. It's been hot all week. So, I'm gonna introduce our guests today Alright, so one of our guests today are from Redding, California They currently reside in Denver, Colorado. An interesting fact about this same person they are licensed to drive a forklift in In Alaska We're gonna guess who we don't know we don't know who could be Let's see. Let's see our other guests. They are from Westbrook, Connecticut or just Connecticut I mean everybody just says Connecticut, you know, I mean, but they currently reside in Sydney Australia night It's horrible. I had to do it. I had to do it And something about this guest They are an ocean swimmer, which means they swim out about a mile out. You ever seen open water? Whoa. Oh, it's creepy. Okay. They were both co workers at Gusto. All right, just a little tiny company you might have heard of. They do some things, payroll, all that cool stuff. Oh, They co founded another company prior to this company called Mintable, which was a leadership development program. And based on the workshop that I saw yesterday, sold out two days ago, sold out people on the floor. It was intense. They still have them leadership development skills. There's no doubt about that. They are the co founders of Tandem. which helps companies manage and facilitate continuous feedback. Listeners and viewers, please give a warm welcome to Melissa Miller. And Lauren Humphrey! Woo! Let's go! We are here, baby! We're here! Yes! The intro! That's what I try to do. Thank you for joining me. Thanks for having us out here. It's been super fun watching both of y'all at the booth. The workshop was amazing. You must be very happy. So how was the experience so far?

Melissa: 2:52

It was amazing and tiring. The introvert in me, the battery level is about negative six at this point, but it's been all worth it. It's been amazing. Great to have co founder in town. Had some amazing meetings. Can't complain.

Kaleem: 3:06

What do you think? What do you think? How do you

Laura: 3:08

feel about it? I feel like the vibe is very strong here. People actually want to talk to you, which feels really good. And, uh, I mean, we spend a lot of time thinking about feedback, but I actually swear people have continuous feedback on their minds. Yeah,

Kaleem: 3:24

yeah, we're definitely in the space of feedback. There's no doubt about that. We've heard some really interesting people talk here in the booth about some of the challenges that they have while giving continuous feedback remotely. So you know, post 2020, you have remote, you have a hybrid, you have all these different modalities of workplace models. So what, as the feedback experts, okay, What do you all have challenges with, or maybe there are some advantages of giving feedback while being remote?

Melissa: 3:57

Yeah, so I think any good feedback relationship is built on having really high standards for each other, paired with a really deep devotion for each other. And I think that there can be a lot of goodness around that in remote work, but it also presents challenges. One of the challenges that it presents is that you have to be really intentional with creating that relationship and having that devotion with the people that you work with. You're not going to just learn their dog's name or how they like to do XYZ around the water cooler. You're going to have to be really intentional about asking those questions, forming that relationship and forming that trust in a remote world. Now that can also have a positive side because just because you're in person doesn't mean that you're doing those things. Maybe you do again around the water cooler in the hallway, you learn about them. And you form a relationship. But also maybe you kind of just let that slide because you're like, Oh, I'm in person. I see them all the time. We must have a great relationship. So in being remote, it forces you to be intentional, which can also be a positive thing. It's like, All right, I got to invest in this relationship. I don't just see them around the water cooler. So I need to invest by asking the right questions, getting to know them, and really forming that trust bond. So I can give them high quality feedback throughout our relationship. That makes

Kaleem: 5:08

so much sense. You know, would be great if there was some sort of application or tool that could help you be a little intentional. It would be interesting, wouldn't it? It'd be so interesting. So what are your thoughts on

Laura: 5:22

those things? So I think a challenge of giving feedback, receiving feedback in a remote environment is that it can feel like it's coming out of nowhere, like an attack. And so if you don't have agreements in place, possibly a tool that says we are going to prioritize and give and receive feedback. Then it can just feel like an attack. Now on the flip side, a positive of remote work is that because you're not just seeing people maybe going out and having drinks after work or doing run club, you don't confuse feelings with feedback as much. So a lot of times, you know,

Kaleem: 6:02

using feelings, Oh, no, really likes me. I love hanging out. She gives me feedback all the time because

Laura: 6:11

that's not the same. No, it's not. And so of course, you know, those bonding moments are really important, but they shouldn't be confused with the actual performance of a person on the job. Right. And so I think some of that removal can make it more about the pure work and is that person meeting goals. That's right. So, I think there's some pros and cons, but would double down on what Mel says that you've got to have the right foundation in place. You've got to be intentional. And then once you've, once you have those ingredients, then you can layer on feedback and I think it can be really meaningful remotely.

Kaleem: 6:45

Wow. That's really interesting there. Both of your ideas are really cool. You have to be intentional on this in a remote work setting, because like, I believe remote work has exposed operational cracks, right? So it's like, no, you weren't doing what you thought you were doing. Right. And then at the same time, you have to think about like, Hey, are we doing this correctly? You know, let's not confuse just because we hang out that we've been getting this feedback. I have a question about. Gusto, right? Like y'all both were at Gusto. You did some great things. What were some things that you both learn there that motivated you to transition to the concept of leadership development at Mentable? So let's start with that story. And then I got to ask when to attend. So let's start with that. Like what did you learn at Gusto? What were some of the things that you saw some pain points that you were like, Hey, We are both here. Let's start our own company.

Melissa: 7:38

Yeah. Yeah. So one of the big things that we learned about Gusto at Gusto was the intentionality they put around leadership development. So managers aren't even called managers at Gusto. There's a word for it. P E's people and powers. So they really leaned into what was the role of managers in the organization. And the founders felt very strongly that it was to empower the folks that they worked with. Gosh,

Kaleem: 8:02

that's great. That's an awesome idea. You think of manager. Now you always have those preconceived notions of what to do, but no.

Melissa: 8:10

Exactly. Cause people carry a lot of baggage with them around the word manager, what it's meant to them in the past. And so we got a lot of training and development around this people in power movement. And I think we carried that with us where it's like, if you invest in your people and what you care about, it'll move your organization forward.

Kaleem: 8:25

How about you? So

Melissa: 8:27

when I joined gusto, there were 40 people and. Over the next five years we grew from 40 people to about a thousand. Wow.

Kaleem: 8:36

And wow.

Laura: 8:37

Rapid growth. Yeah Hashtag rocket ship. What that meant is that there was sort of that trope of Top performers becoming managers and then managers of managers and managers and managers and managers and Things didn't always go well and what I got to see in like almost like a test tube But in real life was that not everyone is born with soft skills. Not everyone Knows how to put soft skills into consistent day to day strategies that can create consistent management and leadership of very big, fast growing teams. And so for me, it was realizing, Whoa, this isn't a thing of shame to not be a good manager. It's more like, this is totally a learned skill that we can arm people with. If you don't, the consequences are bad for everyone. But if you spend time on these soft skills, arming managers with them so that they can then empower their teams, that affects engagement, performance, retention, morale. And again, yeah, just because things were growing so quickly, it felt like being in a lab where we could see if we invest in this skill today, then tomorrow that team is going to perform better. That's, that's

Kaleem: 9:48

really interesting. Almost kind of like, I don't know, I like to use sports analogies a lot. It's like, just because. You're a great player, doesn't necessarily mean you're a great coach. Right? Yeah. And you know, like the Michael Jordan syndrome, we're probably frustrated that everybody can't fly like Mike, like, why can't you fly like me? It's like, no, Mike, hey, like, we need to coach about, it's, it's not there. Right. So that's really interesting. So you all saw what Gusto was doing as far as empowering managers, so that led you to building. Mintable, which was a leadership development program where you went in and you did workshops. I saw your workshop on the first day. What were you doing in the workshop and what was that experience like? Can you tell our audience what that workshop was about and what was the experience like?

Melissa: 10:32

Yeah. So our workshop here at transform was all about zero cost engagement, harnessing the power of continuous feedback. So using continuous feedback to really engage your people because folks are really craving both. you know, the positive stuff. Yeah, everyone gets motivated by knowing what they're doing well. But people are also craving improvement and development feedback. And so talking about how if you lean into feedback within your organization, it keeps folks engaged and keeps them there longer. So that's what we did. Lean on our skills from being a training company of keeping things really practical and really real. People want to hear that other people are struggling with the same things and what have they actually done about it? Less about the theory. We know that things are based in great theory, but what do you actually go and do tomorrow to make a stronger feedback culture in your organization?

Kaleem: 11:18

Really cool. Really cool. So, Lauren, question ion by the way, you are the CEO, Mel's the COO, and you're the CEO. So can you tell our audience, what is it that Tandem is trying to do and help leaders with? So you move from great workshop, by the way, lots of activities. I judge workshops based on how active people are and how much they talk to each other. And this was top notch people on the floor. Mel did such a good job. It was a very good job. It was impressive, Mel. So, awesome. So, they know what they're doing. So, now you transition from putting on workshops. What is it that Tandem's now trying to do with feedback?

Laura: 11:58

Yeah. So, over the course of building the Mintable, we trained. Thousands of managers globally. So we worked with companies with managers literally all over the world and we did live cohort based training of those people leaders. And what we saw over and over and over is that the number one skill that people wanted to learn about was feedback. The number one skill that they stumbled on was feedback. And you know, the sessions where we talked about setting expectations and giving feedback were always the ones that people. Went back to, referred to, were the most engaged on. And when we talked to our customers, those folks in HR and, you know, executives and leadership teams they kept coming back to, Oh, but that session, that one session on feedback was the best thing, the most impactful thing. And so we started to kind of go down, kind of just pull at that thread. Yeah. Well, what's with feedback? I mean, we've always known that feedback is important, but it kind of felt like one of those things that was. Shirley already solved, right. And you know, you're here, this is a crowded market. HR don't really need many more tools thrown at them. But when we put all the Legos out on the table, we realized that there was literally no software tool that helped humans give and receive feedback. And that blew our minds. There's performance management software. Of course there are, yeah. There's software that will help you document a lot of stuff, but there's nothing that helps you actually give and receive feedback.

Kaleem: 13:29

Ah, so as a manager, it helps you

Laura: 13:31

As any employee. Okay. An individual contributor, a manager, a CEO, anyone in the company can use Tandem to give and receive high quality feedback. Pretty cool. Yeah. So, and that's really where we stumbled on. Wow. There's such a difference. And, that if we empower people all across the company with the skill of feedback, their engagement is going to go up. Their performance is going to go up. Their retention is

Kaleem: 13:57

so important, so important, especially in this space where we're working in all of these Different places, flexibility, time zones. You all deal with the time zone being based in Australia. If you're not comfortable giving feedback, it's very difficult. So last question for each of you. Mel, can you tell me a little bit about you just having a, you know, a license to operate a forklift in Alaska? How did that come about? How did that come about?

Melissa: 14:27

Well, you know, you're supposed to go and get your typical summer jobs during high school. I definitely had plenty of those. I cleaned houseboats, served in restaurants, all the good stuff. One of my friends was from Alaska and was like, do you want to come up and do commercial fishing in Alaska for the summer? I was like, you know what? I could do that. Or I could go clean houseboats again. Yeah. May as well go clean fish. And so before the commercial fishing season started, I worked in a cannery. And you get licensed to drive a forklift is one of the first things that you do there. It has not come in that handy since then. Although yesterday while they were setting up the booths, there was a forklift going around. I was like Tap me in coach tap me

Kaleem: 15:05

So lauren earlier we were talking today and we saw this individual with a wolf man Costume on like a mascot and we're standing next to each other. You turn to you. I feel like Oh my gosh, i'm horrified of mascots. Can you please tell me? When you realize that mascots were not the coolest thing and by the way I have a real close friend of mine who was mortified Mortified of Chuck E. Cheese. He couldn't even look at Chuck E. Cheese. I mean, Chuck, the little rat thing is clapping. So when did you realize it?

Laura: 15:41

Yeah. So I didn't actually realize it was a pathology until it happened the first time I was working at a company in DC, Washington, DC. We were at a baseball game. It was like one of those kind of wine and dine thing. And in DC, the Nationals is the baseball team and their mascots are like humans, but with like 15 foot heads on their bodies. And it's like the four presidents, I think on Mount Rushmore, don't quiz me on that. And I honestly don't know. Didn't even know it was a thing, but I saw them and my coworkers, the next thing they said is they were pulling me off the ground because I just like, I don't know how to describe it. It's not right. I get it. I get it.

Melissa: 16:27

Be a person or don't

Kaleem: 16:30

listen. In between. Or a wolf man, but don't be both. That's the best thing I've ever heard. I'm sorry. It's okay. It's not a joke, but you know, we all have our fears. I'm afraid of snakes horribly, but like we can all talk about that. Thank you for sharing that with the whole world and we'll give you some feedback on how you can deal with that as things pop up. So thank you both for having us out. We really appreciate it. Come back anytime.